Debate...

To quit the discussion at this juncture is to quit thinking and "prove" your own point that there can be no conclusions on absolutes.

I come from a very different school of thot...while most ppl are in their beds sleeping I am a slave driver—pushing my intellect past it's biases into the plane of absolute truths....

I readily admit when I am wrong...I have had plenty of practice...at 25 yrs old I have admitted being wrong twice as often as most ppl do by 50—thus I am four times further along in my intellectual development than most ;) obviously a math joke...with a hint of truth.

I am reformed, but I did not start that way. I am a Christian but I did not start that way. I hold to libertarian ideology but I did not start that way. I hold to free market economic theories but I did not start that way. I am in a box but I did not start that way...or I started in the same box that most ppl are still in, you can phrase it anyway you like, but I am a "truth seeker" and can easily detect untruths...I have a knack for it and have trained myself to do this for many years...

And I listen...that is my strength...ppl may not think I listen but I do...that is how I know so much. Only becuz I listen. I have listened/read as much as I can/could and sifted the truth from the lies...I have a working body of knowledge/wisdom and the gift of understanding...to understand philosophers and their dark sayings...

I have mathematical as well as visual acumen...I do not allow my own thots to cloud my judgments. I know pride...I have it, I've been horribly humbled. Jesus was humble, but he did not budge on truth.

I am not Jesus, but where I detect self-contradiction...I too will not budge...but I now have just come to the startling realization that to further discuss this with you would result in a loss of friendship before truth could be culled from the mess...

Blame it on the alcohol...

Well, it's been like forever...God is good, He is faithful even when we are not.

Just live and let live. Is there any validity to this sort of thinking? If this is the driving philosophy by which you live; mmm no, not a prudent modus operandi. But for those that are theistic in their reasoning, and are not pastors, what should the extent of our "meddling" be? Street-preachers I know would call anyone a sinner who does does go out evangelizing the lost. Is this right? Are they right? Don't judge/condemn another man's servant...this leads me to believe that their judgmental spirit is wrong. Now i'm not inconsistently calling them "heathen" or some such nonsense (tho they wouldn't hesitate in applying that word to this "hyper" Calvinist). Just because they are wrong doesn't mean they're gonna burn in hell for it. And that's the thing...they might burn in hell but I have no clue; it's not my call you see? They are so quick to cram religion down the throats of others. Some of these guys I love but they revel too much in stirring up strife and getting arrested "for the sake of the Gospel."

If there is blatant disregard; please approach a brother and nudge him, but if it's not clearly spelled out in Scripture the way that the Baptistic types teach it, then don't hold someone accountable to your theology...hold them accountable to the Word, not your interpretation of it. What you have "Biblical" definitions for: outlining proper Christian living-is what I refer to as an issue of conscience. Don't judge me. I'm learning to enjoy alcohol, does that make me a drunkard? I never get wasted; I continue to go to work; I provide for my family; I don't even "go out" every weekend...Yes, there is a learning curve there is sometimes more; sometimes less indulged in...I'm finding out what my limit(s) are, etc. I use it to make merry, and not all that often either...is that a sin?

Deception

In Genesis we read of the sin committed by the parents of the human race. Often we like to point out how easily decieved Eve was for whatever reason...But what we fail to consider just how easy Adam was self-deceived.

You see the difference between the sexes at this juncture is not 'who is more easily deceived?' but 'how is each deceived?'. Women are more relational and will be more easily taken in by one who appears safe and friendly. OTOH, men are suspicious of others and are more likely to fool themselves rather than be fooled by another.

Just a thot...A generalization, obviously.

Are we in the millennium?

Isaiah 65:17-25

This is not a discourse on heaven-although it does say new 'heavens'-otherwise we would be left to conclude that their indeed is death in heaven.

Throughout Ezekiel and Isaiah I have noticed the discourse concerning the future plans God has for Israel. He wants to give them His spirit and the attendant ability to actually keep His law. There are very many promises made about the new covenant/new heavens and earth to Israel: spiritual Israel by extension.

Without understanding the Church to be the spirtual heir of Israel much of Scripture cannot be made sense of...But in considering the Church to be true Israel the promises of God from the OT can be seen to be fulfilled...The promises given to OT believers are fulfilled in the NT believers.

For us, that means we are living in the age where we build and inhabit; we plant and harvest our own crops...People will begin to live longer. In the same way that men's lifespans slowly dimished to about 70; so we shall see lifespans slowly lengthen to about 100.

Of course I don't know if it will happen in our lifetime, but at the very least I know that I can plant my crops and work hard on this earth because I will reap the temporal rewards for my physical labors. And that knowledge is very motivating..."Occupy till I come..."

Scoffers in the Last Days

Peter speaks at length about what the early Christians can expect to see in their near future. I don't want to take it out of its context but simply want to make an application to today.

2 Peter 3:3 talks about scoffers. Who were these scoffers? They were people who didn't believe...In the former days you had people who were so superstitious they believed just about anything. Monotheism was akin to atheism. But in the last days (which we are in) their will be scoffers...People who choose unbelief rather than belief. To them monotheism is akin to superstition.

Our God has not changed in the millennia that true believers have known Him but everything around us has...In this day and age we need to learn to deal with scoffers and not the polytheistic paganism of the former ages. The NT itself was written in the last days, or the time of scoffers, Jesus and the Apostles all dealt with unbelief. We can look to them for guidance on how to deal with scoffers.

It is written that the preaching of the cross is foolishness to them...We also see extensive use of the Law-Word of God in bringing conviction and conversion. We also see the humility of Christ and His disciples as well as love amongst the brethren.

In the contemporary age we have great examples to follow as well. Francis Schaeffer and the L'Abri Fellowship with its brotherly love towards all...Greg L. Bahnsen who with every breath stopped the mouths of the scornful...Gordon Clark with his Christian theistic philosophy in opposition to the philosophy of unbelieving man...

We should take comfort knowing that the extreme unbelief was not unforseen but was expected. If you have dealt with scoffers take heart, they have chosen unbelief; they are tares. They may be elect and thus we ought always to share the gospel with them, but don't get discouraged when they only revile you. They claim science but they hold to doctrines which are falsely called science. Our God is the creator and sustainer, without which science could not exist. If ignored by the scoffers, they do so to the damnation of their souls...

Don't criticize me...

Yes, I'm in the Navy. But I'm on leave, what did you expect? I don't get much time to even pretend to grow a beard/mustache/goatee/whatever...